Tynwald Votes to Keep Bishop

Tynwald members have voted against a motion to axe the Bishop from parliament.

The motion by Douglas East MHK Joney Faragher would have removed the Bishop after the retirement of current Bish Peter Eagle.

The vote was lost with 8 MHKs voting for the motion, 16 against, while LegCo voted unanimously against.

Ms Fragher said it wasn’t a case of ‘bashing the Bishop’ but rather a matter of principle.

• I did miss the earlier speakers due to an over running meeting, so this is not the entire debate.
• Onchan MHK Rob Callister has posted his reasoning for opposing the motion, which can be found here.

During the debate, members spoke on the history of the role, which goes back hundreds of years, while others said the presence of the Bishop brought a sense of perspective to events.

Bill Henderson MLC spoke with great passion on the issue, saying the role was one that has evolved into that ‘puts elements forward for us to contemplate’ and the work done to represent the vulnerable in society. He added that removing the Bishop would see Tynwald ‘lose a wide slice of our diversity’.

Members also spoke on the issue of whether removing the Bishop would bring an end to the diocese, which they said would great impact on the island.

Others noted that removing the Bishop was not a priority for the public and that they should get on with serving the people of the island.

Speaking in favour of the motion, Lawrie Hooper said the argument that Lord Lisvane, in his long forgotten by most report, had said the island should keep the Bishop in Tynwald was a case of an unelected person from an unelected chamber recommending an unelected person should keep their unelected seat. He also noted that in the past Tynwald has managed to get along fine when the island existed without a Bishop in between appointments.

The Lib Vannin leader also noted that this was not a ‘push the button’ moment, rather it would only be the start of a legislative process.

Jayne Poole-Wilson (Middle), who was a fresh out the box MLC the last time the matter was debated, said she ‘absolutely’ values the role of the Bishop in Tynwald and that she remains supportive of the continuation of the role, albeit without a vote. Mrs Poole-Wilson said that the issue of what this would mean for the diocese is a ‘separate matter’.

Chris Thomas (Douglas Central) said he didn’t agree with removing the Bishop in part because it would cut the number of MLCs who could vote from nine to eight.

Claire Christian (Douglas South) said she didn’t seem the reason behind removing the Bishop and criticised the motion as it appeared to be looking towards further constitutional change.

While Tim Johnston (Ayre and Michael) said the motion had failed to recognise the true role of the Bishop and the life experience they brought to Tynwald. However he did recognise the reasons behind the motion and questioning the role of the Bishop in a democratic sense.

Andrew Smith said that the removal of the Bishop risked our institutions, said the role is one that can represent marginalised people in Tynwald and said the island was lucky to have had someone as experienced as Peter Eagles, who previously had worked in a chaplain role in the British Army.

Daphne Caine (Garff) spoke out in favour of the motion saying that the role was ‘undemocratic’ and said that this wouldn’t be as major of a change as some suggest.

Julie Edge (Onchan) said she believed there were far more serious issues that could be debated by members than the matter of the Bishop and also spoke on the history and importance of the role as she saw it.

Speaking on the debate, Bishop Eagles said he welcomed that Tynwald was spending such time debating the role and offered us his view on what he does on ‘Tuesdays and sometimes Wednesdays’.

Acknowledging the ‘awkward interface’ between religion and politics, he said he has loved being a member of Tynwald and when his work takes him off-island he works to promote Tynwald’s style and function as a parliament and the island as a place to be. In what could be seen as a thinly veiled threat, he said that if the Bishop didn’t play a full role in Tynwald, he may not promote the island’s parliament to others in such terms.

Looking at the issue of unelected members of Tynwald, said that people in that role can bring forward ‘legitimate descent’ and the ‘independent voice’ on key issues.

Tim Glover (ACM) said he ‘not comfortable’ with removing the Bishop and admitted part of that was a ‘gut feeling’ and criticised the attention paid to this issue over many others such as population imbalance.

Chief Minister Alf Cannan said that the issue was an ‘important debate’ and recognised the need of members to debate the constitution of Tynwald. He said that many of his constituents still support the diocese and the role of the Bishop and that to lose that would be a ‘significant loss’.

Peter Greenhill MLC, who said he was not religious and doesn’t believe in any god, but praised the role and said he would oppose the motion.

Dr Alex Allinson (Ramsey) said the debate had been ‘very useful and insightful’. He said that while many had given history lessons, this was a different Tynwald to the one that rejected the proposals to banish the Bishop in 2017 and Ms Faragher was right to bring forward the motion.

Diane Kelsey MLC said she wouldn’t support the motion and praised the value of the Bishop in Tynwald.

While Tanya August-Hanson said she had previously wanted to remove both the Bishop and the AG from LegCo, but she had now moved on the matter and would not vote to remove him.

Responding to the debate, Ms Faragher said it had largely been a well intentioned debate, though criticised the questioning of why she had brought the debate to Tynwald seeing as the last house had debated it.

Ms Faragher said she didn’t think it was right to determine the basis of the island’s parliament ‘based on a threat from the Church of England’ and said no-one had actually made clear the benefits of the island having a diocese.

She added that allowing one faith a seat and vote in Tynwald was not the way to boost inter-faith dialogue or that that person can represent people of all and no faith. The Manx Labour Party leader also criticised the belief that prayers are necessary at the start of sittings and suggested members could read the Nolan Principles or even their own manifestos out loud.

Ms Faragher finished by saying that the public being unable to hold a member of the parliament to account is ‘incongruous’ and said the continuation of the role of the Bishop blurs the lines between religion and law making.

Vote

Maltby Amendment

MHKs: For 14 – 10 Against
MLCs:  For 0 – 8 Against

Failed

Watterson Amendment (had to be held twice as Julie Edge voted wrong way first time)

MHKs: For 14- 10 Against
MLCs:  For 1- 7 Against

Failed

Motion

MHKs: For 8 – 16 Against
MLCs:  For 0 – 8 Against

Failed